"If there is no clear protest of Abkhazian society, if there are no journalists, Garibashvili government and majority of Usupashvili wouldn't be able to understand the theme of the annexation"
"We shouldn't advice to Abkhazians - we have to offer"
The President of Georgian-Abkhazian and Georgian-Ossetian House", Professor Nestan Kirtadze talked to "Premier":
I am talking to politician, historian and accordingly I am interested in your estimation of those processes that are developed in Abkhazia today - Russia is preparing annexation of Abkhazia. Is it possible the this intent of Russia to be realized and is there is way out from this situation - I mean agreement of Sukhumi and Tbilisi that will make Kremlin to refuse to its intent?
- I will try to exactly express emotions and interest of Abkhazian people and Abkhazian society and interest that they had concerning state changes in Spring-Summer of 2012. It was natural and they were waiting for clear signals, but they received conception that was even for Georgians incomprehensible, thick document where every article was in contradiction to each other.
In emotions they received another toast about brotherhood and united future.
From new political leader they received new "keys" of regulation of relations and formula that sounds this way: "I have in Moscow so many oligarch friends, I will come to them, will invite on tea and will return Abkhazia..." our people met this with applause...
It was the period when every signal should be clear and pragmatic for our relative people; it was the period when behind the scenes of Georgian-Abkhazian relations should be most active and pragmatic.
I said to Bidzina at that time to meet personal representative of Ankvab, I said I could arrange meeting, I talked about several ideas and advised him to talk about, in other case it would be late for them and for us too.
I gave Ivanishvili idea that I already sent to Ankvab and it was idea of unity of two Georgian states and that was met by Ankvab cabinet with big interest and it was also unexpected.
To be honest we talked with Ivanishvili about many issues. Moreover, among them about the meeting organized by "Georgian-Abkhazian and Ossetian International Movement", where there was talking about new package of peaceful platform in front of politicians, diplomats, experts and international media.
But there was not result... I informed about this alternative peaceful platform to Paris, Berlin, Brussels, Moscow and lately to Washington...
I remember Sergei Karaganov said to me in Moscow, - this is so unique that it is impossible to believe in... he said on diplomatic language that Georgians don't have power to do it and Moscow will not do it. Russia plays with time in its favor and continues to restore Empire. It will continue.
- How do you think was it right the "Greens Policy" and in common what kind of strategy Georgia have to have towards occupant country?
- I am sorry but "Greens Policy" I called to the way chosen by this government and it is clear that I have critical attitude. First Ivanishvili and after the cabinet of his successor couldn't use the chance to put the issue of independency, sovereignty and subject of state integrity of the country on international agenda.
They had to demand different meditative spaces, had to work with experts of Europe and world, among them to strengthen issues of economic politics towards conflict regions and also there are many things. Instead Ivanishvili cabinet begun concession policy with the excuse to begin dialogue with Russia. Greens, wine and singing became that main politics with Russia.
Zurab Abashidze became as distributor of Georgian wine produced by Russian companies.
Unfortunately this is strategy of will and practical policy of independency, sovereignty of dispersed Georgia. At the same time the Prime Minister of Georgia makes apprehensible statements that are deadly for Georgia and on other hand advices to Abkhazians to be with Russians. I am sorry I talk too much.
After 2008 the government of Georgia at that time and political power that came into governance in 2012 ignored "remember Abkhazia". It is confirmed by the fact that in the condition of expected annexation Georgian society is passive. Is it not necessary that occupied territories to become the first priority for Georgian political life? May be there is no need to make this theme active? If there are no strict statements and estimations of diplomats and experts of former government and if there is no strict protest of Abkhazian society and their position, if there are no journalists Garibashvili government and Usupashvi majority wouldn't know this theme. And when they knew and when they were informed that there is need of the position we all saw how helplessness government showed. And this all it tragic that these Misters and Misses are talking with the name of the state.
- In Georgia there is no issue on which political spectrum and the society reaches consensus. On November 15 National Movement announced action to protest annexation and to make government to be more active. The government stated that National Movement is moving to the direction of marginalization. Also the part of non-Parliamentarian opposition states that those who will come on the action will make lustration. Is such kind of radical "political sauce" is good for the country and you as the citizen of this country do you think that there is necessity to use all the ways to avoid annexation of Abkhazia?
- There are issues and themes that should be equal for all political forces and for the society. All have to share common responsibility. Today this theme is annexation of Abkhazia, Tskhinvali is also working on such kind of document.
- How this tragic moment is estimated in the politics of Georgia and from makers of public opinion is in your question. There is one conclusion - if we continue to move this way Georgia will move on inertia then will stop somewhere and somewhere it will end...
- Is it expected that you will come on this action where participate some representatives of non-Parliamentarian opposition, and also citizens with different political tastes?
- I think we all know for a long time that homeland is not subject of taste; I think we all know that with heart I carry my homeland; I live with and breathe with.
Big part of journalists were my students and you remember how we say good bye after every lesson: "Till next meeting my friends and remember - love your homeland!!!", however we used to meet each other every day.
On November 15 there is action of protection of independency, sovereignty and statehood of our homeland. If there is no the action of November 15 this government wouldn't know what happened to Georgia. It is clear, me, Nestan Kirtadze, as the President of "Georgian-Abkhazian and Ossetian International Movement" have solidarity towards this events.
- And finally, you have very many friends in Abkhazia who perceive in a right way those threats they face right now, what can you advice to them?
- Abkhazian people brought their identity through centuries, their language, mythology, traditions, folklore, and unique character. Their best advisor is their enormous responsibility for development. And do you know what their unique trait is? They always face the future.
Abkhazian will never concede not independency and also will not cut its way to the future. During last 200 years Abkhazians always used to were under threat of Rusification and they always used to manage to escape from. Today Abkhazia is ruled by the favorite government of Russian Federation. In spite of this believe me Abkhazian society will not allow this government to make annexation of Abkhazia. It will begin the process of cropping of the project offered by Russian Federation and it will be seen different way after this. We will see it in near future. This will be dangerous political turn for Russia.
As for us, we shouldn't advice to our friend Abkhazians, which is big lie and will be from everyone who is doing it - but we have to offer. We have to offer bold political, economic collaboration on the level of constitutional law. Have to offer permanent peace guarantee on constitutional level - with proper definition. We don't have to offer autonomy, that brings smile on the face, but idea of unity of two Georgian states and to begin meditative negotiations of neutral places...
This government can't understand and can't realize it, but believe me, in spite of everything this model will be the basis of coexistence and co-love of Georgians and Abkhazians.